sangmami
07-27 12:44 PM
Talked to an io at neb sc.within 5 sec of me starting to talk the ffice interuppted and she apologosed for doing that and said because of huge vol of appli there is a delay in the receipt notice.i SAID I AM july 2 nd filer and she said it might be in the first week of aug..(i had said the same thing in my earlier post too after i spoke toa diff officer)..She asked to keep checking the check clearnace.
Hope this helps
Thanks
Hope this helps
Thanks
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Almond
01-03 09:05 PM
Yeah he's gonna have to pick one of the two and declare her his "one and only" wife. Everyone will know who the favorite is:D.
Libra
07-03 10:25 AM
I thought to but now don't want to comment on your posting because you were already born confused:D
Ugh, I paid thousands to the lawyer over the years. And the medical was a ripoff. They better send me a free pass for 30 days at some nude bar with my green card or...I'll just have to go there anyways to celebrate:p
Ugh, I paid thousands to the lawyer over the years. And the medical was a ripoff. They better send me a free pass for 30 days at some nude bar with my green card or...I'll just have to go there anyways to celebrate:p
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pmb76
01-06 02:57 AM
singhsa, Your friend just has to pray for Mitt Romney to be president who may solve his problem :D
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saketkapur
06-09 06:35 PM
http://imminfo.com/Newsletter/2009-AILA/Likely_visa_bulletin_cutoff_date_movement.html
Likely Visa Bulletin cutoff date movement
Information provided at the 2009 AILA Annual Conference gives us some insight into likely Visa Bulletin cutoff date movement over the next year. Historically, the INS/CIS have treated filing backlog information as a matter of national security - refusing to release any information. Recently, however, cracks have started to appear in that wall.
We know that the 2007 filing surge resulted in an enormous number of cases submitted to the CIS. The actual number of new I-485s filed is unknown, but estimates range from 350,000 to 500,000. We also know that the CIS, having the fear of God put into them by the State Department in 2007, finally increased their level of production and began adjudicating cases at a pace sufficient to use up each year's quota and not waste any allocated visa numbers through non-use.
At this year's conference, the CIS representatives made several statements which, if true, give us hope for a return to sanity soon. They alleged that they have completed enough EB I-485 cases this year to exhaust the EB quota (140,000). They also alleged that they will soon have completed the "pre-adjudication" of another "110,000 to 120,000" cases to be used against the quota for the next fiscal year (Oct. 1, 2009 - Sept. 30, 2010). Finally, they represented that these adjudication would "pretty much exhaust" the inventory of pending EB I-485 cases at the TSC and NSC.
If these statements are true, then the end of the current mess is in sight.
If the CIS really has wiped out its processing backlog, then when the "pre-adjudicated" cases are given visa numbers in the next fiscal year, cutoff dates should advance rapidly. At a minimum, we should see them return to February 2007 levels, if not closer.
Implicit in this recital of statistics by the CIS personnel is the likelihood that they denied a truly massive number of pending I-485 applications. Before anyone panics, those denials should have been sent out already and are not out there just waiting to ruin someone's day. Only by assuming a very large number of denials does the math make any sense. Without them, you cannot reconcile the large volume of filings with the volume of approvals.
Once these pending cases are closed out, the known "demand" for EB visas will be much smaller and the Visa Office will be able to move priority dates up quickly; in some cases by years.
Another factor to be taken into account is the number of people who have lost their jobs between August 17, 2007 and whenever the cutoff dates cross that chronological line again. In years past, if there were 100,000 applicants with priority dates between August, 2007 and today, we could expect to see at least 90,000 applications. Today, with the economy being what it is, I think the figure is probably closer to 50,000. These are all people who were not eligible for AC21 because they had not filed for adjustment of status. If true, this means that cutoff dates will advance more rapidly than normal after the "2007 deluge" cases are resolved.
Of course, all of this becomes academic if CIR is passed. In that case, all priority dates will become "current" overnight and remain that way for years.
The State Department official at the AILA conference said that we can likely expect to see the following cutoff dates in the October, 2009 Visa Bulletin:
EB2 Worldwide: Current
EB2 China and India: Outlook is "grim" and there may be further retrogressions until later in the fiscal year.
EB3 Worldwide: June 1, 2005
EB3 China: March 1, 2003
EB3 India: November 1, 2001
EB3 Mexico: March 1, 2003
These estimates are just that - estimates. They are, however, estimates from the Department of State.
Where numbers move after October 1st will depend entirely upon the demand presented by the CIS. If, in fact, they have pre-adjudicated as many as 120,000 EB AOS cases, then it is unlikely that we will see much additional forward movement until the fourth quarter of the fiscal year (July - Sept., 2010). As discussed previously, however, once we get over this large bump in the road next year, we can expect to see a rapid advance in cutoff date movement.
Copyright � 2009 The Gotcher Law Group, PC - All Rights Reserved
Likely Visa Bulletin cutoff date movement
Information provided at the 2009 AILA Annual Conference gives us some insight into likely Visa Bulletin cutoff date movement over the next year. Historically, the INS/CIS have treated filing backlog information as a matter of national security - refusing to release any information. Recently, however, cracks have started to appear in that wall.
We know that the 2007 filing surge resulted in an enormous number of cases submitted to the CIS. The actual number of new I-485s filed is unknown, but estimates range from 350,000 to 500,000. We also know that the CIS, having the fear of God put into them by the State Department in 2007, finally increased their level of production and began adjudicating cases at a pace sufficient to use up each year's quota and not waste any allocated visa numbers through non-use.
At this year's conference, the CIS representatives made several statements which, if true, give us hope for a return to sanity soon. They alleged that they have completed enough EB I-485 cases this year to exhaust the EB quota (140,000). They also alleged that they will soon have completed the "pre-adjudication" of another "110,000 to 120,000" cases to be used against the quota for the next fiscal year (Oct. 1, 2009 - Sept. 30, 2010). Finally, they represented that these adjudication would "pretty much exhaust" the inventory of pending EB I-485 cases at the TSC and NSC.
If these statements are true, then the end of the current mess is in sight.
If the CIS really has wiped out its processing backlog, then when the "pre-adjudicated" cases are given visa numbers in the next fiscal year, cutoff dates should advance rapidly. At a minimum, we should see them return to February 2007 levels, if not closer.
Implicit in this recital of statistics by the CIS personnel is the likelihood that they denied a truly massive number of pending I-485 applications. Before anyone panics, those denials should have been sent out already and are not out there just waiting to ruin someone's day. Only by assuming a very large number of denials does the math make any sense. Without them, you cannot reconcile the large volume of filings with the volume of approvals.
Once these pending cases are closed out, the known "demand" for EB visas will be much smaller and the Visa Office will be able to move priority dates up quickly; in some cases by years.
Another factor to be taken into account is the number of people who have lost their jobs between August 17, 2007 and whenever the cutoff dates cross that chronological line again. In years past, if there were 100,000 applicants with priority dates between August, 2007 and today, we could expect to see at least 90,000 applications. Today, with the economy being what it is, I think the figure is probably closer to 50,000. These are all people who were not eligible for AC21 because they had not filed for adjustment of status. If true, this means that cutoff dates will advance more rapidly than normal after the "2007 deluge" cases are resolved.
Of course, all of this becomes academic if CIR is passed. In that case, all priority dates will become "current" overnight and remain that way for years.
The State Department official at the AILA conference said that we can likely expect to see the following cutoff dates in the October, 2009 Visa Bulletin:
EB2 Worldwide: Current
EB2 China and India: Outlook is "grim" and there may be further retrogressions until later in the fiscal year.
EB3 Worldwide: June 1, 2005
EB3 China: March 1, 2003
EB3 India: November 1, 2001
EB3 Mexico: March 1, 2003
These estimates are just that - estimates. They are, however, estimates from the Department of State.
Where numbers move after October 1st will depend entirely upon the demand presented by the CIS. If, in fact, they have pre-adjudicated as many as 120,000 EB AOS cases, then it is unlikely that we will see much additional forward movement until the fourth quarter of the fiscal year (July - Sept., 2010). As discussed previously, however, once we get over this large bump in the road next year, we can expect to see a rapid advance in cutoff date movement.
Copyright � 2009 The Gotcher Law Group, PC - All Rights Reserved
kaisersose
06-05 03:00 PM
if they did what u say they did.. they violated the law. thats what gotcher is talking about.
Where is the law that says they can release visa numbers only on a quarterly basis? If that is true, then
1. The Feb bulletin would not have said EB-2 India had used up its annual limit.
2. The June Bulletin would not have said EB-3 will retrogress or become unavailable starting July [which starts a new quarter].
Both make no sense. Or alternatively, there is no such law and DOS can release visa numbers without the "quarterly" constraint. It may have been a practise in the past, but clearly since 2007, they have become keen to see visa numbers not go waste and they appear to have changed the trend.
Only a tiny fraction of applications are on . It really is nowhere enough to draw a meaningful analysis of approval trends.
Where is the law that says they can release visa numbers only on a quarterly basis? If that is true, then
1. The Feb bulletin would not have said EB-2 India had used up its annual limit.
2. The June Bulletin would not have said EB-3 will retrogress or become unavailable starting July [which starts a new quarter].
Both make no sense. Or alternatively, there is no such law and DOS can release visa numbers without the "quarterly" constraint. It may have been a practise in the past, but clearly since 2007, they have become keen to see visa numbers not go waste and they appear to have changed the trend.
Only a tiny fraction of applications are on . It really is nowhere enough to draw a meaningful analysis of approval trends.
more...
LostInGCProcess
02-11 04:24 PM
I found the formual still working on the variables :-)
http://www.acm.org/crossroads/xrds9-4/gfx/equation008.gif
:D:D:D Wow!! that was so simple, Thanks.... :D:D:D:D
http://www.acm.org/crossroads/xrds9-4/gfx/equation008.gif
:D:D:D Wow!! that was so simple, Thanks.... :D:D:D:D
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sorcerer666
04-29 01:51 PM
Disclaimer: I am just someone who once seriously considered getting a degree in Strategic Studies. I am not from India. If you don't like what I have to say or feel that it is not my *place* to say it, just ignore me. I will not get engaged in an online wrestling match to demonstrate my "e-toughness".
It will not have any major repercussions b/w the 2 countries or any impact on the Green Card situation. Relations b/w US and India encompass a much broader spectrum than just a large defense contract. India's economy presents enormous opportunities for US companies, there is the issue of countering China and not to mention the same view on most regional as well as international security issues. They will not get any where if they start slugging it out every time there is a lost trade deal. India has helped US in the past with Iran's nuclear program while US has shown the importance it gives India by pushing an exception from NSG in nuclear energy.
If anything I am surprised that US is surprised that they lost the bid. Both Rafael and the Typhoon are amazing platforms. I did not read the actual RFP but it is arrogance to assume that the US offerings were inherently any better than the European offerings.
@kumara121: I can assure you that Uncle Sam does not want to "..come and check the planes whenever and wherever it wanted to". If I only had a dollar for every conspiracy theory I hear from people from our part of the world (Pakistan, Indian, Bangladesh) I would have been in Eb-5 years ago :)
The biggest issue was that the US offerings were very comparable to existing Mirage 2000 platform that IAF already has. The MRCA is a long term upgrade and does not make sense to get a plane that is so close to the existing inventory.
Bottom line? The GC aspirants did not gain or loose anything. IAF won by getting a hot fighter, the only loosers are Boeing and Lockhead.
Great analysis!! Eurofighter is newest of them all... moreover, Indians have already made great indigenous design enhancements to the existing SU-30 MKI's that they really wouldn't want an American make anyways. I'm not sure why the SU-35's aren't in that list??
It will not have any major repercussions b/w the 2 countries or any impact on the Green Card situation. Relations b/w US and India encompass a much broader spectrum than just a large defense contract. India's economy presents enormous opportunities for US companies, there is the issue of countering China and not to mention the same view on most regional as well as international security issues. They will not get any where if they start slugging it out every time there is a lost trade deal. India has helped US in the past with Iran's nuclear program while US has shown the importance it gives India by pushing an exception from NSG in nuclear energy.
If anything I am surprised that US is surprised that they lost the bid. Both Rafael and the Typhoon are amazing platforms. I did not read the actual RFP but it is arrogance to assume that the US offerings were inherently any better than the European offerings.
@kumara121: I can assure you that Uncle Sam does not want to "..come and check the planes whenever and wherever it wanted to". If I only had a dollar for every conspiracy theory I hear from people from our part of the world (Pakistan, Indian, Bangladesh) I would have been in Eb-5 years ago :)
The biggest issue was that the US offerings were very comparable to existing Mirage 2000 platform that IAF already has. The MRCA is a long term upgrade and does not make sense to get a plane that is so close to the existing inventory.
Bottom line? The GC aspirants did not gain or loose anything. IAF won by getting a hot fighter, the only loosers are Boeing and Lockhead.
Great analysis!! Eurofighter is newest of them all... moreover, Indians have already made great indigenous design enhancements to the existing SU-30 MKI's that they really wouldn't want an American make anyways. I'm not sure why the SU-35's aren't in that list??
more...
rb_248
10-29 12:00 PM
NRK,
Did you visit any country that might have triggered this?
Have you ever faced any issues with your last name being on no fly list?
You have pretty much answered no to most of the questions asked by other posters. If the answers to the above questions are no too, then it must be USCIS error.
Did you visit any country that might have triggered this?
Have you ever faced any issues with your last name being on no fly list?
You have pretty much answered no to most of the questions asked by other posters. If the answers to the above questions are no too, then it must be USCIS error.
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GCOP
07-13 01:56 PM
Congratulations on Getting the GC. You really deserve it after such a long journey.Thanks for your support to IV and IV Members.
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svam77
08-10 12:47 PM
I just pity you man .... cant u understand what i said about my reason to take an LC .......jsut not to wait to apply for i 485 for another x years ......
Your discussion is going no where ........I wouldnt even have cared if it was a last month's labor .......
And also USCIS would have initially implementecd this for a good reason and they would not have terminated it if they wouldnt have found that many companies were misusing it ......
Anyways ....if u have time .....keep going on this discussion, on a topic which USCIS itself closed last month ...
U told once , twice or n times on this forum that u dont like LS, and yes USCIS heard it and closed it .... so just forget it ....
the guy who actually started this thread must be enjoying seeing all these posts hahahhahhah
Your discussion is going no where ........I wouldnt even have cared if it was a last month's labor .......
And also USCIS would have initially implementecd this for a good reason and they would not have terminated it if they wouldnt have found that many companies were misusing it ......
Anyways ....if u have time .....keep going on this discussion, on a topic which USCIS itself closed last month ...
U told once , twice or n times on this forum that u dont like LS, and yes USCIS heard it and closed it .... so just forget it ....
the guy who actually started this thread must be enjoying seeing all these posts hahahhahhah
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kiran24
03-14 04:19 PM
wcs, Welcome to IV.
The campaign has been in place for almost 2 months. Thousands of letters have already been mailed out. The deadline is Mar 10. Please pick out a format and mail U'r letter to the president and IV ASAP.
Sample letter formats can be located at
http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/showthread.php?t=16506
Were the letters mailed? Btw I sent my letter to IV aswell as to President.
The campaign has been in place for almost 2 months. Thousands of letters have already been mailed out. The deadline is Mar 10. Please pick out a format and mail U'r letter to the president and IV ASAP.
Sample letter formats can be located at
http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/showthread.php?t=16506
Were the letters mailed? Btw I sent my letter to IV aswell as to President.
more...
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hsingh82
04-13 04:04 PM
So after more than a month of sleepless nights, thanks to Immigration Voice looks like my I 485 application is back on track.
A recap of my situation:
Last month I got an email from USCIS-CRIS stating that my I 485 was withdrawn. After being in this country for close to 10 years and in the immigration queue for more than 7 years why would I withdraw the application ??? I did not withdraw my application !!!
It took me more than a month to find out the reason behind the withdrawal..trust me it was not easy..and guess what ....It was my Attorney who had withdrawn the application in Error. Now what ... I call USCIS multiple times.. talk to many different IO's .. some of them patient and try to help.. some extremely rude.. but all of them had only one thing to say... they cannot help!!..... I get an Info Pass... no help there either.. I set up an emergency meeting with my attorney (one of the large Immigration Law Firms) .. nothing...they accept their mistake tell me that they will do all they can .. but no assurance that they will reinstate the case .. limited forward movement.... things look gloomy and bleak..no one can help me.
Then I called Immigration Voice on the number that is listed on the site and left a voice mail. Promptly got a call back I spoke to a Core member who understood the gravity and urgency of the situation and swiflty moved forward and got in touch with their contacts in the government. The Core member also put me in a conference call with the person who was going to look into my case, I was so relieved that I could explain the situation first hand.
I got a call today and I was told that after evaluating my case my file has been reopened and they have mailed an offical notice regarding the same and I should get it in a few days. *Fingers crossed until I get this notice in hand ;)*
The IV core was extremely sensitive to my situation and were very responsive and extremly helpful. I cant thank Immigration Voice enough for helping me resolve this issue in a quick manner.
I have registered to be a recurring contributing member and I intend to be an active member of this group.
My lessons from this crazy experience are:
- Never trust your attorney, always ask for a copy of any letter/document they send to USCIS on your behalf
- There is no organization besides IV out there that is looking out for the interests of the Immigrant Community.
- We need to strengthen IV in all ways we can, we need to be active.
- And as so many members have already said "We are IV." If we want things to be better "WE" need to do something about it.
I urge members who are still contemplating becoming active members to evaluate their options and to become active and contributing members of IV.
- Peace
Great job IV :)... keep up the good work!
A recap of my situation:
Last month I got an email from USCIS-CRIS stating that my I 485 was withdrawn. After being in this country for close to 10 years and in the immigration queue for more than 7 years why would I withdraw the application ??? I did not withdraw my application !!!
It took me more than a month to find out the reason behind the withdrawal..trust me it was not easy..and guess what ....It was my Attorney who had withdrawn the application in Error. Now what ... I call USCIS multiple times.. talk to many different IO's .. some of them patient and try to help.. some extremely rude.. but all of them had only one thing to say... they cannot help!!..... I get an Info Pass... no help there either.. I set up an emergency meeting with my attorney (one of the large Immigration Law Firms) .. nothing...they accept their mistake tell me that they will do all they can .. but no assurance that they will reinstate the case .. limited forward movement.... things look gloomy and bleak..no one can help me.
Then I called Immigration Voice on the number that is listed on the site and left a voice mail. Promptly got a call back I spoke to a Core member who understood the gravity and urgency of the situation and swiflty moved forward and got in touch with their contacts in the government. The Core member also put me in a conference call with the person who was going to look into my case, I was so relieved that I could explain the situation first hand.
I got a call today and I was told that after evaluating my case my file has been reopened and they have mailed an offical notice regarding the same and I should get it in a few days. *Fingers crossed until I get this notice in hand ;)*
The IV core was extremely sensitive to my situation and were very responsive and extremly helpful. I cant thank Immigration Voice enough for helping me resolve this issue in a quick manner.
I have registered to be a recurring contributing member and I intend to be an active member of this group.
My lessons from this crazy experience are:
- Never trust your attorney, always ask for a copy of any letter/document they send to USCIS on your behalf
- There is no organization besides IV out there that is looking out for the interests of the Immigrant Community.
- We need to strengthen IV in all ways we can, we need to be active.
- And as so many members have already said "We are IV." If we want things to be better "WE" need to do something about it.
I urge members who are still contemplating becoming active members to evaluate their options and to become active and contributing members of IV.
- Peace
Great job IV :)... keep up the good work!
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shamu
01-11 12:21 AM
1.In general private insurance does not cover maternity benefits. But private insurance holders are eligible for negotiated price.
In general negotiated price are around 50-70% less than the actual price.
2. Choose doctors from your network. eg: many anesthesia doctors are out of network.
3.Complications will be covered by your insurance. So do not worry about this.
4.Take a payment plan from hospital.
Thank you Pallavi,
I knew about point 3 but could not confirm with any one.
About point 4, I am trying to find a hospital that would provide a payment plan in Dallas area.
In general negotiated price are around 50-70% less than the actual price.
2. Choose doctors from your network. eg: many anesthesia doctors are out of network.
3.Complications will be covered by your insurance. So do not worry about this.
4.Take a payment plan from hospital.
Thank you Pallavi,
I knew about point 3 but could not confirm with any one.
About point 4, I am trying to find a hospital that would provide a payment plan in Dallas area.
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kumar1
02-28 02:33 PM
---
I am not answerable to an anonymous "internet toughie" who picks up fights on forums. it's evident that your understanding of the tonality in a professional response vis a vis a personal one is impaired albeit imponderable.
I shall not waste my time "coaching" the same.
[B]"then we all know who the real immature person is"
After your fiasco with Kumar, doesn't this whole forum apart from a few thousand scandalized visitors know who really enthrones "immaturity" here?
With this i end my diatribe with you mr internet toughie aka sledgehammer. lol
I am not answerable to an anonymous "internet toughie" who picks up fights on forums. it's evident that your understanding of the tonality in a professional response vis a vis a personal one is impaired albeit imponderable.
I shall not waste my time "coaching" the same.
[B]"then we all know who the real immature person is"
After your fiasco with Kumar, doesn't this whole forum apart from a few thousand scandalized visitors know who really enthrones "immaturity" here?
With this i end my diatribe with you mr internet toughie aka sledgehammer. lol
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DSLStart
08-09 09:17 AM
Read question no. 13
MurthyDotCom : 485 FAQs (http://www.murthy.com/485faq.html#13)
Attorneys will obviously give this kind of answer because their loyalty is to their client which is the employer who gives them their revenue. So they'll answer which would be in favor of their client. Inspite of several questions of this kind on her forum she or any of her attorneys have not cited a single example of anyone running into trouble on this issue.
MurthyDotCom : 485 FAQs (http://www.murthy.com/485faq.html#13)
Attorneys will obviously give this kind of answer because their loyalty is to their client which is the employer who gives them their revenue. So they'll answer which would be in favor of their client. Inspite of several questions of this kind on her forum she or any of her attorneys have not cited a single example of anyone running into trouble on this issue.
more...
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abused
11-28 04:33 PM
July 6th filer awaiting FP (no SR opened yet). My case has been transferred back and forth between Nebraska and California. I asked my lawyer - he advised me to "Sit tight as there is nothing that can be done except to wait for them to process my I140, I485, I765 and I131 applications."
So here I am, still being underpaid and abused by my current emloyer. ...waiting for the day that I can escape and get a better paying job and work in an employee-friendly environment.
So here I am, still being underpaid and abused by my current emloyer. ...waiting for the day that I can escape and get a better paying job and work in an employee-friendly environment.
girlfriend but it has new variations
texanguy
06-17 11:07 AM
This is by far the best action item i have seen so far (because it feels like it can be done by administrative change). I Support it 100% .
A REQUEST TO IV CORE:
Please start a letter campaign: I have been long trying to figure out who exactly is the decision maker for this policy. It would be a great help if we all know where to send the letters and who should we address to...
A REQUEST TO IV CORE:
Please start a letter campaign: I have been long trying to figure out who exactly is the decision maker for this policy. It would be a great help if we all know where to send the letters and who should we address to...
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badlucky
05-14 06:23 PM
hmm, i think munnabhai did the right thing.
sometimes people give irrelevant advice. one guy asks im getting divorced, what shud i do with respect to 485? if people tell him, stop worrying bout 485, focus on ur life and fix ur marraige, then its not helping him from a "forum" perspective.
thanks
sometimes people give irrelevant advice. one guy asks im getting divorced, what shud i do with respect to 485? if people tell him, stop worrying bout 485, focus on ur life and fix ur marraige, then its not helping him from a "forum" perspective.
thanks
chanduv23
08-11 05:40 PM
If you have an approved I-140 and the job description matches that of your Labor, you shouldn't have any issues. The job title shouldn't matter either, it's all in the description/role/responsibilities and the technology. If the technology/tool changes then it's an issue because the Labor you have tells that there is a shortage of people in that area.
Good Luck!
How much does technology come into picture? I changed jobs using AC21 and am on EAD, my new job utilizes only 50% of the skills from previous job and am getting trained in new technologies in the new job. I am not sure if the new employer will list all technologies mentioned in the labor, but will definitely list all those that are being used. Any comments?
Good Luck!
How much does technology come into picture? I changed jobs using AC21 and am on EAD, my new job utilizes only 50% of the skills from previous job and am getting trained in new technologies in the new job. I am not sure if the new employer will list all technologies mentioned in the labor, but will definitely list all those that are being used. Any comments?
ashkam
03-27 11:55 AM
I am not the one who is arguing for the sake of it. You are. So far I haven't seen any "in depth" logical reasoning from you. I am not replying anymore to your arguments unless you come up with some real logic.
Also, until you explain how an illegal intruder in a house doesn't qualify as a security threat, all your requests for logic smack of hypocrisy.
Also, until you explain how an illegal intruder in a house doesn't qualify as a security threat, all your requests for logic smack of hypocrisy.
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